tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8320313747187588188.post3085856420713940118..comments2024-03-28T13:59:11.445-07:00Comments on Left Behind and Loving It: Two-and-a-Half StoriesD. Mark Davishttp://www.blogger.com/profile/12016377712982292924noreply@blogger.comBlogger11125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8320313747187588188.post-88170119028888240012021-08-07T12:10:41.484-07:002021-08-07T12:10:41.484-07:00Yes. Unfortunately on the water walking the sign /...Yes. Unfortunately on the water walking the sign /miracle aspect is kind of crucial to the story and its cente point structurally.Bruce MacKayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12186107910368395860noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8320313747187588188.post-53515317831150638972021-07-25T07:29:57.388-07:002021-07-25T07:29:57.388-07:00Hi Bruce. One of the challenges of these stories i...Hi Bruce. One of the challenges of these stories is to let each one have its own integrity, before holding them together with other versions of the same. The curious switch from ἀνθρώπους to ἄνδρες deserves study on John's terms. Of course, we cannot help but hold it alongside of Matthew 14:21, "And those who ate were about five thousand men, besides women and children." Is John, like Matthew, recalling an account that - for some reason - specified the number only indicated the men? If so, then we can speculate on the source material, as well as John's and Matthew's use of it. I don't know if we can come to conclusions. You offer some great food for thought, so to speak. <br />Likewise, with the way John describes Jesus walking on or along the water (περιπατοῦνταἐπὶ τῆς θαλάσσης) - I have simply assumed that this was the walking on water miracle, but your comment allows me to think that it could certainly be something more like walking alongside the water, particularly with the note that when they were wanting to take him in they were already ashore. So, thanks for that. <br />MDD. Mark Davishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12016377712982292924noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8320313747187588188.post-90046406532415222572021-07-22T12:40:02.095-07:002021-07-22T12:40:02.095-07:00The same versions footnote also suggest only the m...The same versions footnote also suggest only the men sat together as women and children ate separately. Perhaps they helped serve the men then dined on the 12 baskets left over - culturally appropriate?Bruce MacKayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12186107910368395860noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8320313747187588188.post-89401850068822368072021-07-22T12:37:22.419-07:002021-07-22T12:37:22.419-07:00A NT version i have translated from aramaic/syriac...A NT version i have translated from aramaic/syriac suggests that Jesus was walkibg along the shoreline from Tiberias to Capernaum and would have been perceived as walking on water to those in the boat - also rowing parrallel to the shore. Makes sense to me. Why would they have left him behind if he had no other way home? Bruce MacKayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12186107910368395860noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8320313747187588188.post-35606499751786980882021-07-21T14:06:00.826-07:002021-07-21T14:06:00.826-07:00Quite different from Mark's "You give the...Quite different from Mark's "You give them something to eat," isn't it? I think John and Mark have quite different ways of presenting Jesus and that shapes the way this story is told. Great observation.<br />MDD. Mark Davishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12016377712982292924noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8320313747187588188.post-66290378946748586462021-07-21T14:04:55.850-07:002021-07-21T14:04:55.850-07:00From what I understand, it may indicate something ...From what I understand, it may indicate something more of the order of sardines than bass, that would make a fish spread that would go on the bread. I can't remember either where I read that, but it made a lot of sense as a way of carrying fish on a trip of this sort. <br />MDD. Mark Davishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12016377712982292924noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8320313747187588188.post-84628224079811701042021-07-21T07:26:01.875-07:002021-07-21T07:26:01.875-07:00I read in some commentary (or dreamed that I did) ...I read in some commentary (or dreamed that I did) that the fish [ὀψάρια] in John's account were described as "dried fish" as opposed to "little fish". It probably "makes no nevermind" but I admit to spending too much time on the hermeneutical loop trying to make that make a difference. Anything to it?MeBohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17945107767374925463noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8320313747187588188.post-84962489394052814062021-07-20T18:31:30.162-07:002021-07-20T18:31:30.162-07:00Just a note that intrigues me: in John it is Jesus...Just a note that intrigues me: in John it is Jesus Himself who distributes the bread and fish, not the disciples.bcpreacherhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13583878496606134903noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8320313747187588188.post-27218659389347596462018-07-29T06:11:03.316-07:002018-07-29T06:11:03.316-07:00Friends,
I had erred in an earlier comment that I...Friends, <br />I had erred in an earlier comment that I made comparing John's feeding story to the synoptic story. I have since removed the error. Sorry for any confusion. <br />MDD. Mark Davishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12016377712982292924noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8320313747187588188.post-17505108730999975002018-07-29T06:10:14.229-07:002018-07-29T06:10:14.229-07:00That's a great point, BC.
In this case, the f...That's a great point, BC. <br />In this case, the feeding story and its following discourse will result in many 'disciples' leaving Jesus before the chapter ends. <br />MD D. Mark Davishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12016377712982292924noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8320313747187588188.post-80238600423388167722018-07-26T13:01:09.243-07:002018-07-26T13:01:09.243-07:00One big difference for me between this gospel and ...One big difference for me between this gospel and the synoptics is that in this gospel, Jesus feeds the crowd himself...in the synoptics, he gives the bread and fish to the disciples to distribute.bcpreacherhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13583878496606134903noreply@blogger.com